Why the Remain Alliance was an over baked, oven ready Welsh fudge up

Here I'm re-posting a comment I just left on another article. It's about a way to stir things up from inside the polling booth without having to wait for political parties to consent to electoral reform. In the 1990s, when I was involved in elections, it was usual for candidates and their agents to be shown ballot papers that had been irregularly completed. I hope it still is. One example was where a voter had obliterated my name with a mass of crossings out. My opponent claimed the vote on the basis that, as he said, "the voter's intention was clear" and the returning officer accepted that. The ballot paper could have been declared invalid, because voters aren't allowed to add anything that allows them to be identified, and I knew my patch and I knew exactly which rude cow had done this. But I said nothing. Why bother? I won anyway. In 2017 I used the westminster ballot paper as if the election was STV, marking 1, 2, 3, 4 in the various candidates' boxes (but nothing for tory and UKIP). At the top I wrote "My intention is clear. PR now" in the hope that the LibDem would see the ballot and claim my vote (not that I really favoured the LibDems then or now). Of course I don't know what happened to my vote but it seems to me that if enough voters did likewise it would be a non-violent guerrilla action which would cause flaming rows at counts everywhere, legal challenges, and pressure for positive change.

IF Wales representation is reduced to only 29 MPs. That will be the case to leave the UK. It is clear the UK does not really want. Our nation of Wales has a lot to offer the rest of the World. We have a lot of natural water. A good lamb production industry. As an independent nation we can collect our own taxes, have our own central bank, issue our own currency. Let us build our own political structures fit for the 21st century. Yes Cymru need to get to North East Wales and prove to our people there that submission to the UK Tories will not bring many benefits. Plaid Cymru needs to build mass support as the SNP have done in Scotland. A no-deal Brexit is likely to cause real economic hardships to Wales (and beyond) and we cannot look to England for solutions. - We need to do it for ourselves.

Exactly this. Let's blame everyone else other than the Labour leadership. Some people really need to get off social media, they get trapped in the bubble of the like minded and reality is a distant concept. The "average person" seen through some of the Labour policies - free wifi for all etc..( I'd love free wifi , i can hardly afford to pay my bill but let's keep it real !!!) and they seriously disliked Corbyn and his momentum champagne socialist gang who are taking Labour away from its true heartlands (see the 2019 election). But most importantly why do we in Cymru continuously elect parties who's really couldn't give a toss about how we survive day to day, or give a majority to a party in the Senedd who are obviously happy to keep us at the bottom of every table and why are we content to be the Oliver of the British Isles "please sir can I have some more (of our own resources)" No more standing for the same old sh*te. YMLAEN CYMRU !

That happened in Monmouthshire. Pre election, there was a minimal amount from Labour who came second. The LD candidate, a local girl, tried really hard & massively increased her vote but did not overtake labour. The Greens & Plaid fielded candidates in a lack lustre way but only got a few votes. The sitting MP , David Davies who has steadfastly ignored the remain referendum result, was returned with a 10,000 majority but it was reduced and a minority vote against the others. . If there had been one creditable opponent, there would have been a different result. The political voting system is undemocratic & flawed, but will never be changed by the major parties who know they will have much to lose. Therefore we have to use it to advantage if we wish to change it. The election results even now, are not representative of the majority vote if added up together. Over 3 years of political wrangling have produced confusion & chaos with the electorate as well as the politicians,The cracks, uncertainties & confusion are now conveniently covered over in fragile blue tissue paper. There are many strange results with unrepresentative MPs elected. Ynys Mon with an English speaking Londoner from Kensington representing a Welsh speaking constituency is an example, with the new MP declaring “Ill move to the island & learn Welsh! Incredible! Where in all the news coverage of all the goodies going to be heaped on “The North” has there been one tiny mention of Wales, which is in just as much need? The Senedd elections will be next. What suggestions will there be to reorganise the disenfranchised remain voters whose voices were not listened to and are still being ignored? There is urgent work to be done to effect change. Change, by the way, does not mean more of the same.

Brexit is happening .... just lay off the "anti-British traitor" stuff............people can be still wanting to be in the EU while also respecting the democratic result.........I agree that 'revoke' is an anti-democratic position and is against democracy.....but traitorous for someone to personally favouring EU membership? Live and let live.....brexit is happening..leave them to their view the very word British has been bloodied and corrupted since its early celtic origins :D ... what is "anti-British" anymore...when the actual British language has been pushed back to the cliffs of West Wales!

Agree with you. What is the next step? Plaid Cymru MUST win for Wales' future. Yes Cymru / AUOB must also build on thi campaign.

"It was evident from the outset that this would not work well for Plaid, ..." However on the General Election evidence it looks like it didn't work out badly either. Overall % of the vote was down a bit but all four seats held were retained with the two most marginal recording increased majorities. Plaid Cymru's pro Remain stance is being held up, mostly by pro leave supporters I think, as a reason for why Plaid Cymru did not make gains in this election. I suspect the same people may have been quite looking forward to some Plaid Cymru loses. I think that the reason Plaid Cymru did not make gains has more to do with the electorate being (at the moment) massively anti Welsh independence rather than it being slightly(at the moment maybe) pro Brexit.

I wonder how much money Plaid Cymru's super credible strategists get paid for coming up with their failed election strategy - that worthless coalition and obsessing with Remain in a country which has voted for Brexit. The SNP represented their country ,Plaid did not. I am a Remaining, middle age west Walian scratching a living, not working for public bodies, nor on on a fat wage in Cardiff and looking forward to a fat pension , like many of the middle class myopic Plaid Cymru policy deciders. Neither am I on social media but I do talk to people from all walks of life every day , something politicos do not do. As they are are stuck in a twitter and facebook silo of the right on thinkers and champagne socialists, just read the Guardian, totally out of touch. Rather than building a consensus on how to take the party forward by consulting with their grass roots they mix among themselves in their constituency offices and committees, slapping each other on the back for a managed decline. A few thing to ponder , advice given free to PC Many people in wWales are small "C" conservative by inclination, some employ a few people and work hard - they are not interested in left wing, socialist policies. They want a better country but "socialist" labels scare them. Plaid also needs to hold their local authorities behaviour to account as well if they want to keep the voters happy. Just look at Carmarthenshire, where a Plaid Cymru run council, overlorded by a flacid, dubious and cowed Plaid Cymru leader (controlled by the previous Chief Exec) who is happy to persecute people who have been wronged by corrupt officials; happy to threaten his fellow PC councillors if they attempt to help a family wronged (see Trishia Breckman case). Is this the Plaid Cymru we want? No wonder 14000 people voted for Tories in East Carmarthenshire Dinefwr nearly knocking Jonathon Edwards ( a genuine bloke ) off his perch - how foolish can Plaid's misguided decision be?. Their decisions centrally jeopardise the hard work done locally by good people, they failed to get Ynys Mon and once again lagged behind the Tories and Brexit party - both loony fringe parties . Gwynedd CC giving money to a private arms company Quinteq ( the party of pacifism!? What would Lewis Valentine say?) . Ceredigion CC allowing England owned housing associations to build surplus accommodation for the "homeless". Next time when they want to appeal to the normal voter, with a poster girl , use a woman who runs her own business in west Wales and employs people., not an ideological fundamentalist of any denomination, be they Muslim, ultra orthodox Jew or Evangelical Christian, Pagan or Druid ( religion is all bollocks and should be kept out of politics,) . Stop embarrasing yourself and the Welsh by asking for compo , surely the most embarrassing and stupid thing I have ever heard in my life coming from Adam "I am a son of a Miner" Price. Getting applauded by an English TV studio audience does not win you Welsh votes if you play to that particular Anglocentric metropolitan, gallery.