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Your Party Welsh organisers brand behaviour of UK officials 'beyond shameful'

By Mark Mansfield
Beth Winter (L) and Mark Serworka. Photo Yui Mok PA Wire

Martin Shipton

The two co-convenors of the new left wing Your Party in Wales have blamed unnamed officials in charge of the UK party for stalling the project.

In a joint statement, former Cynon Valley Labour MP Beth Winter and ex-general secretary of the PCS union Mark Serwotka said it was “beyond shameful” that the actions of a few officials were hindering what they were trying to achieve in Wales.

The pair’s latest statement follows threats of legal action relating to delays in getting money collected from thousands of members into a central bank account.

The statement issued by Ms Winter and Mr Serwotka says: “Recent statements and actions at Your Party's UK level have left many of us - once genuinely hopeful about the creation of a credible left wing alternative - shocked and seriously concerned.

“This behaviour and the needless division it spreads is indefensible. It fails members, it fails supporters and it fails the country.

“In Wales, we are pleased to say that such attitudes and actions do not exist. Instead, there is a strong consensus and shared commitment to building a grassroots, community based politics that offers a democratic socialist alternative to the prevailing neo-liberal capitalist system.

“Our inaugural all-Wales gathering on October 25 was a huge success, with around 400 people in attendance to plan the immediate way forward. We were pleased to receive support from Jeremy Corbyn MP and Zarah Sultana MP at our Merthyr meeting, both of whom spoke passionately about the need for a different kind of politics and the necessity to have full democratic control of our economy by the workers and not a system built on private profit.

“There was strong support for the plan presented for an immediate way forward in Wales and for the development of all Wales interim and long term structures, strategic options for the Senedd election and core values and principles. These include being an anti-austerity, pro-peace and pro workers party that stands for the redistribution of wealth and power, public ownership of utilities underlined by tolerance and compassion towards others, and supporting local community developments, both economic and political.

“Since that date, we are pleased to say that within the last week, the interim steering group has had its first meeting to take forward the necessary organisational work and to discuss campaigning at a local level, emphasising the need for that outward facing work to take this fledgling organisation forward.

“The IT and comms group is also continuing to meet and carry forward its work, as are the 15 plus local groups that already exist across Wales to organise and campaign within the local communities and feed into the All Wales Plan. Thank you - diolch - to everyone for your hard work, enthusiasm and commitment to growing and embedding this new kind of politics within our communities across Wales.

“Moving forward, though, the need for access to the sign up and membership data and resources from UK Your Party is essential. We have made several requests for this and for meetings with the UK leadership without success, which is why we are now making a statement on this matter.

“That we are being hampered by Your Party UK and our ability to take this enthusiasm and hard work forward in Wales is an understatement. Without the membership data, we are unable to contact everyone individually unless Your Party UK sign off on correspondence, which they have failed to do on several occasions. The inability to share this information with us here in Wales flies in the face of any commitment by Your Party UK to autonomy and self-determination for the people of Wales. We will not allow Wales to be treated with contempt, and it is beyond shameful that the actions of a few at the centre of Your Party at a UK level risks hindering what we are trying to achieve here in Wales.

“We cannot and will not allow this to happen. We want to be working in our communities here in Wales, representing and campaigning in the interests of the working people of Wales. We know we can do it given the support and information we require. 31,000 people in Wales signed up initially to the idea of a new left party.

The statement concludes: "There is a clear appetite here to do things differently and to break with the established political and economic mores. “We want the people of Wales to own and control the wealth created here, and to have the autonomy to be making decisions as they affect the people of Wales. It's as simple as that. We are 100% behind the need to break with the establishment politics that no longer works for the people of Wales. We want to develop a politics that is for the people with the people of Wales, and we are determined to take that forward, to be an example to the rest of the UK.

“In the meantime, please continue with your local organising and activities, being active in our communities, working at a grassroots level alongside local people and groups to build a real alternative for the people of Wales. “This is the foundation of our new party and together we will turn that vision into reality. We will be providing regular updates of developments in Wales moving forward.”

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29 comments

Sex realist

Another party that says "trans women are women" - why do left wing parties hate women?

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Colin

Presumably they also say "trans men are men" and so hate men too, so why are you only making it about women?

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Agnes Nutter

?! I think they support ALL women. It just happens to include the women that you don't like. Also your Party famously have a transphobia problem. Jut google it. There's a bunch of news site stories about it. The Telegraph, the Canary, The Atlantic, The Mail I think. Are you just looking to blanket attack left wing parties?

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David Richards

Despite Your Party's calamitous 'life of brian'-esque shenanigans it sounds like Serwotka and Winter are still intent on taking votes off plaid and the greens in the Senedd elections next May and so letting Reform in thru the backdoor in the process. Highly irrresponsible conduct on the part of both of them - but perhaps unsurprising from two individuals who've spent their poliitical lives in and out of the neo liberal, very establishment (and unionist) Labour Party. Nuff said.

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Ben

Ironically, the same thing is EXACTLY happening in Wales. Serwotka is self-appointed leader who keeps complaining that people aren't happy about his transphobia. Despite Mark's claims, in Merthyr, despite us spending an hour voting on whether we would be allowed to vote, things weren't going his way and we ended up not voting on anything at all.

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CapM

If there are problems what's stopping these people starting a stand alone Wales/Cymru type of Your Party apart from a devotion to maintaining a British state and mining us for votes.

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Lyn E

There is a good case for a legally separate Your Party in Wales, with its own finance, data and policies, but with a close cooperation agreement with Your Party in England to work together on UK-wide issues. Unlike Plaid Cymru, it would be a socialist party rather than one wishing to build Welsh capitalism.

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Colin

If they completely oppose capitalism surely that makes them communist?

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In reply to Colin

Lyn E

It's better seen as a question of emphasis. Although it postures as left-wing, Plaid Cymru's economic vision as expressed in 'Making Wales Work' is explicitly one of building Welsh capitalism. For example, it only promises to 'look at measures to grow the share of Welsh GDP accounted for by co-operatively, employee- and socially owned businesses to at least the UK average - from 0.6% to around 1.6% - by 2036, with a view to matching the European average of 5.5% by 2050 at the latest.' Feeble. Democratic control and ownership is central to the perspective of Welsh socialists, who look more to Tower Colliery than to the Soviet Union.

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In reply to Lyn E

Colin

Employee-owned businesses are still capitalism. Your post appeared to scorn the very idea of capitalism in any form.

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In reply to Colin

Lyn E

I think you're confusing capitalism and markets.

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In reply to Lyn E

Colin

This is the fundamental point isn't it. When you talk of socialism, are you talking about market or non-market socialism?

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David Richards

1) you must have missed the reference to creating a decentralist socialist welsh state in plaid's consitution (Your Party of course still hasnt even got a constition). 2) Your Party categorically isnt aiming to create an independent socialist welsh state because its a brit left organisation which wants to preserve the unity of the british state - a british state which has exploited Wales' natural resources and the Welsh people for centurues...a british state which even tried to exterminate the Welsh language.

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In reply to David Richards

Lyn E

Practice counts for more than lines in constitutions that are easily ignored. Labour's history shows us that. There is no socialist perspective in Plaid Cymru's 'Making Wales Work', which aims to build a capitalist 'Welsh Mittlestand'. As I understand it, Your Party (I am not a member) supports 'autonomy and self-determination' for Wales. That position encompasses the possibility of independence, which I think is wise until its advocates can explain how it would work.

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In reply to Lyn E

Colin

What's their position on private profit? If they abhor it in all its forms, even social enterprises which can't pay wages out of losses, they can only be in favour of the state owning and running everything. If that's the position, why hide their true selves when they should be proudly shouting from the rooftops "let's make communism great again".

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In reply to Colin

Lyn E

The YP draft political statement proposes taking back privatised industries but does not advocate 'the state owning and running everything'.

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In reply to Lyn E

Colin

Perhaps they should hold a vote at conference to decide between the following two ideological positions. Do members want Your Party to (a) abolish private profit and markets or (b) celebrate private profit in a well regulated and fairly taxed market environment. I left out the only other ideological position - deregulation, low tax and small government - for obvious reasons.

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In reply to Colin

Lyn E

Why are you trying to create a artificially polarised divide? Everyone in or around YP believes that markets should have no role in allocating health care and that markets cannot be relied on to provide other basics of life (e.g. housing) for everyone, but nobody is advocating nationalising every small business. The exact line to be drawn between public and private provision, and how these should be owned, managed and regulated, is an important debate but one that is most productively conducted in the context of specific industries, services and places, not reduced to abstract ideologies.

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In reply to Lyn E

Colin

Because this is a fundamental principle for any new political party, it's not something to be figured out later. But socialist healthcare is mainstream even after 14 years of Conservative government, no-one serious wants a choice of ambulance provider when they're unconscious after an accident. Most agrees the current system just needs to work. So we don't need YP for that. And on housing. Most agree the state should own enough housing to stop homelessness. Most agree Thatcher's fire sale went too far and should be reversed. So we don't need YP for that. So what do we need them for? Which markets will they abolish? Because snide comments that markets are the problem implies all markets are in scope to be abolished and we're on a road to a world where the state owns and runs everything.

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In reply to Colin

Lyn E

Where have I said I want to abolish all markets. You're just making stuff up. You assert that YP is not required because 'socialist healthcare is mainstream even after 14 years of Conservative government'. Sorry, no it isn't. It has only been preserved under persistent attacks because people have fought for it, as Nye Bevan always argued. YP should sustain that fight and for proper funding. You claim 'most agree the state should own enough housing to stop homelessness.' Yes, most people do, but Labour is not going to hit its proclaimed housing target without large-scale council housing, which it refuses to do. Again, there is a clear need for an alternative that would make that investment. To repeat what I said in my previous post, 'The exact line to be drawn between public and private provision, and how these should be owned, managed and regulated, is an important debate but one that is most productively conducted in the context of specific industries, services and places, not reduced to abstract ideologies.' It's better to engage with real arguments than to invent ones you can easily dismiss.

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In reply to Lyn E

Colin

Even the centre right (the Cameroons) profess to love this NHS. Only the hard right that took over under Johnson with help from Corbyn seriously want to abolish socialist healthcare. Previously I wrote that you seemed to "scorn the very idea of capitalism in any form" and in response you wrote "I think you’re confusing capitalism and markets" which clearly implies you oppose markets in any form. The fundamental principles around markets, profit and private ownership need to be established before any line can be drawn between private and public provision. Otherwise there is nothing to stop the party becoming a gateway to communism. Which is fine if that's what the party wants, just be honest about it rather than lobster boiling moderate socialists.

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In reply to Colin

Lyn E

How have you managed to twist my comment 'I think you’re confusing capitalism and markets' to imply that because I criticised capitalism therefore I 'oppose markets in any form', when it obviously means the exact opposite? Bizarre. I don't know what you mean by 'fundamental principles around markets, profit and private ownership' unless you want YP to commit to neoliberalism. As I've already stated, the exact line to be drawn between public and private provision should be seen in the context of specific industries, services and places, not reduced to abstract ideologies. Indeed, the form of ownership is not reducible to a simple public-private split, once we allow for forms such as cooperatives, workers' control or community projects. Many public functions and properties have been privatised and should be retrieved.

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In reply to Lyn E

Rob

A lot of this debate seems to rely on a false choice between “Welsh capitalism” and “pure socialism”. The reality is that every successful small nation blends markets with social ownership in a way that suits its needs, and Plaid’s position is no different. Plaid Cymru isn’t trying to build some Welsh version of corporate capitalism; it’s trying to stop the profits generated in Wales from leaking out of Wales. That’s not “feeble” — it’s basic economic sovereignty. Countries like Denmark, Finland, Norway and Iceland all combine private enterprise, co-operatives, and strong public sectors. No one calls them capitalist or communist; they’re simply normal independent countries making decisions for themselves.The problem in Wales isn’t that Plaid wants to “build Welsh capitalism”. The problem is that Wales currently has no meaningful control over its economy at all. We’re stuck in a UK system where wealth is extracted out of Wales, and the British-state left has never offered a serious alternative. Your Party may claim to support Welsh self-determination, but that doesn’t mean its membership would necessarily embrace it. There is a long history of socialists opposing Welsh nationhood on the grounds that it “divides the working class of England, Scotland and Wales”. That was the standard Labour-left argument against devolution throughout the mid-20th century, and that mindset still survives today. Many of whom oppose nationalism of any kind. Meaning" Your Party’s" supposed openness to independence is, at best, conditional. If the British left were serious about autonomy, they wouldn’t be so nervous about Wales having the power to shape its own economic model — whether that leads to more co-operatives, more public ownership, or both. Right now Plaid Cymru is the only party even attempting to put economic power in Welsh hands. That is not capitalism or communism, it is the basic right of a nation to decide its own future.

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In reply to Rob

adopted cardi

Bore Da Rob, I'd just say to all that - its not the basic right of "a nation" to tell us we've got to have nuclear power for instance, for the sake of economics. For me that is a massive turn off and vote loser. I'd say that Plaid is very good in many ways- but economics is not the be all and end all. Britain directed by Economic England, directed by Trump and the Corporations, is just a grossly unequal, war driven, racist, class ridden place. The real Wales is a bit of an Oasis in all of that. At the least there is no class system here. Its always going to be a mix of ideas. Could we take one of the leaves out of Ireland's book, for example?

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In reply to Rob

Lyn E

Thanks for this serious response. As the article indicates, UK YP has yet to show sufficient respect towards autonomy in Wales and Scotland, although there is a wider dispute over data and finances. There are different views on how unified or federal YP should be. The Welsh membership strongly favours autonomy. It’s too soon to know how this works out. Plaid Cymru has more energy and direction today than does Welsh Labour. I would not be unhappy with a Plaid-led government, although I hope the Greens and YP (if they choose to stand) get seats. But I disagree with much of what you write. Nationalism can be divisive. Small nations can be just as vicious as large ones, given the chance. I do not consider the worldwide turn to nationalism, when our problems are more than ever global, to be positive. The best Welsh traditions, such as the 1920s women’s peace petition or solidarity with the Spanish Republic, looked outwards. Through much of the 20th century the labour movement acting at a UK level did offer a way forward. The South Wales Fed joined the NUM to increase bargaining power. For the Valleys generation that lived through the depression, the 1945-51 government was transformative. Labour was rewarded with huge majorities for decades. Times have changed but we shouldn’t rewrite history. I agree Wales has insufficient control over its economy. But we should not exaggerate what formal independence would offer. We would still exist in a world dominated by finance and tech capitalism. England would remain our major trading partner and would demand a high degree of compliance with its rules. The nationalist model loses credibility by not recognising such constraints. ‘Extraction from Wales’ is secondary to exploitation of Welsh people. ‘Making Wales Work’ recognises ownership as fundamental but in nationalist rather than class terms. This is Plaid Cymru’s blind spot. Welsh-owned businesses or landlords can be just as oppressive to workers or tenants, or destructive of the Welsh environment, as English-owned ones. A socialist perspective understands that. ‘The basic right of a nation to decide its own future’ is an outdated notion in an inter-connected world. Even the US under Trump is struggling to assert its sovereignty from economic dependencies. Climate collapse is a global crisis that negates pretensions of nations deciding their future. Constitutional change could increase Welsh control over some of our affairs but it won’t change the world.

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Undecided

Pure comedy. Do everyone a favour and give up.

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Agnes Nutter

Mark Serwotka has no moral high ground to stand on after going against the members of his own Union the SCS so many times, like it was his own personal fiefdom

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Agnes Nutter

The solution is simple. Just vote Plaid Cymru. We don't need the centre-left fiscally conservative pseudo-trots known as Your Party, splitting the vote away from Plaid Cymru

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Ernie The Smallholder

That's Centralism for you. 'Your Party' is likely to make the same mistake as the Communist party of the Soviet Union. As with the Ukraine and the Baltic states in their relationship with Russia: There is no democratic solution for Wales, nor Scotland to be run by an English parties. The USSR has failed. The UK IS FAILING NOW. CENTRALISATION OF ECONOMY AND POWER DOES NOT WORK. That is the problem with the MONOPOLY CAPITALIST SYSTEM. Plaid Cymru and the Green Party to their credit have policy making here in Wales. We need a confederal meetings with England, Scotland and Ireland similar to the Benelux system. Both Plaid Cymru and the Welsh Greens are in FAVOUR to join EFTA, EEA with full EUROPEAN UNION membership. The EU is a decentralised union of independent nations.

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1) you must have missed the reference to creating a decentralist socialist welsh state in plaid's consitution (Your Party of course still hasnt even got a constition). 2) Your Party categorically isnt aiming to create an independent sociali...

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