Tory MS accused of defection approach after lashing out at Reform

Emily Price

A Welsh Conservative MS who lashed out at Reform UK in a recent podcast interview had talks about defecting to the party late last year, a senior party source has claimed.

A senior Reform UK insider told Nation.Cymru that Shadow Cabinet Secretary for Health, James Evans, had a discussion about jumping ship to Nigel Farage's party in November when he attended a farmers protest in Westminster.

Evans has very strongly denied Reform's claim.

The revelation comes after the MS for Brecon and Radnorshire appeared as a guest on the For Wales, See Wales Podcast where he predicted that a Reform led Welsh government would "fall apart on day one".

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'Egos'

In the episode, which went live on YouTube on Thursday (May 1), Evans said: "I think they'd quite happily sit on the side, watch and say ‘we've been an effective opposition, please vote for us at Westminster and we will try to either abolish the Senedd’ or do something crazy along those lines to try and win votes.

"I just don't think they're a serious contender. I think they'd walk into Cathays Park on day one, if they did manage to get enough numbers, and we'd be run by the civil service for the next four years.

"I just do not think they'd be able to pull a program for government together. They haven't even got a leader, I think they'll fall apart on day one, because they're going to all walk into the Senedd, all sit down with all these big egos around the table and think 'one of us here is going to have to be the First Minister of Wales'."

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'Splinter group'

He added: "I know some of the individuals involved, and I guarantee six or seven of them all want to be First Minister. As soon as that starts being dangled in front of them. [Some] will probably turn around say 'well we'll form a splinter group, because we're not happy with that.

"And if we form a splinter group, maybe we can get a few extra committee positions or a leader of an opposition money’. That's how they'll work."

Reform UK currently doesn't have a Welsh leader but is fronted by Clacton MP Nigel Farage - someone Evans has previously posed with for photos.

Recent polling shows that Welsh Labour, Plaid Cymru and Reform UK are bunched together on voting intentions for next year’s Senedd election, whilst the Tories are lagging behind on 15%.

Evans told the For Wales, See Wales Podcast that he thought Reform's popularity was down to the "dangerous" rhetoric being used by the party.

He said: "I find it quite scary actually. I was talking to somebody on the weekend about the Reform's messaging and using scapegoats and simple slogans for very difficult, complex issues.

"Reforms arguments of using certain elements and demographic of the population as scapegoats for all our country's problems is dangerous rhetoric in my opinion."

When we approached Reform UK for a response to Evans' comments - a senior source said they were shocked because the Tory MS had told Reform staff last year that he was considering defecting.

'Sinking'

The source said: "Mr Evans talks about Reform having no leader yet we have the most popular leader in Wales, Nigel Farage and unlike Darren Millar, people actually know who he is.

"It seems that Mr Evans has had a dramatic change of heart after openly telling staff members in Reform that he was contemplating defecting us, not that we would have taken him anyway.

"We look forward to watching James go down with the sinking Tory ship."

They added that the discussion took place six months ago in London when Evans - a farmer himself - took part in a protest against Labour's proposed changes to inheritance tax for farmers.

At the time the Brecon and Radnorshire MS was overseeing the rural affairs brief in the Senedd shadow cabinet.

On the day of the protest, several Conservative sources contacted Nation.Cymru with concerns that that Evans may defect to Reform.

But several days later the Welsh Conservative MS dismissed the claims out of hand telling us that although he sympathised with some of the views expressed by Reform – he was still "fully committed" to the Tory Senedd group.

In a statement released today, James Evans said: "The claim that I was considering defection to Reform is simply not true.

"While I sympathise with some of their calls for more common sense in politics and greater efficiency in government, I am and have always been fully committed to the Conservative Party, as I have been my whole life.

"I will be working closely with Darren Millar to fix Wales and bring about the change that our country so desperately needs."

When Evans' attended the farmers protest in London last year, the Conservatives in the Senedd were being led by South Wales Central MS Andrew RT Davies.

He was toppled from the top spot in December by seven members of his own shadow cabinet - Evans included - amid a row over the group's stance on devolution and Davies' use of social media.

Davies' Chief Whip Darren Millar was later coronated the new leader of the Senedd Tories and Evans was appointed the new shadow health secretary - arguably the largest and most complex shadow cabinet brief.