Children’s magazine criticised after calling Welsh ‘a waste of money’

Had enough of this s h i t....digon yw digon. Cocia wyn

The language is a hobby to those of us who were born in Wales, brought up in Wales but regard themselves as British. Only the extremists make such a fuss about the Welsh Language, not the 90% odd whose first language is British English. The Scottish Gaelic language features on signs and publicity in Scotland but its promotion is quite different and less intense than the Welsh Language in Wales. Stop using my money and other resources to promote it and let it swim or sink on its own merits.

Stop using my noney to support the English language in Wales.. English is big enough and ugly enough to look after itself. Most Welsh people are supportive of Cymraeg .. it's only a few British-Welsh extremists who are prepared to let Welsh sink or swim.

If the magazine had made such remarks about the NHS translating material into over 120 languages the left would be up in arms calling for the writer and editor to be sacked.

Define "bollocks" and tell us what is a legitimate view.

And to Phil Lewis, what money is spent promoting the English Language?. Yes it is often used across the world and frequently as a second language but that isn't promotion. I would object to the English language being promoted just as I do to the promotion of Welsh. In fact it's a pity that Latin was allowed to die. Nobody invested anything to save Latin did they? But that's another story.

If Brian ap Francis truly believes that it is *his* money which is being spent on Welsh-language causes, then I wonder which of the Welsh charities and movements he supports by his donations? But if he believes that money raised in taxes remains the property of the individuals who paid those taxes, and not of society as a whole, then in effect he does not approve of taxation. Or if he believes that the state should be more accountable to those who pay more in taxes, then he does not approve of democracy. And those beliefs are just as questionable as his pugnacious attitude to the Welsh language.

Has Brian ap Francis not heard of the English-language promoting British Council?

What utter utter nonsense. Outrage over an article that asks a question of people and one for them to think about actively too, not one that gives any opinion whatsoever. Some of you are so short sighted by your passion to see welsh dominate in such a way that it's really destructive. What the language and nation needs is discussion and debate and encouragement to discuss these issues, not shooting down every time the opportunity expresses itself. Such outrage at healthy encouragement of thought and debate is such a turn off to support nation cymru, and if anything just encourages more eye-rolling at such nonsense emotion

As a Welsh child in the education system I find some of these comments truly awful! I have been forced to learn Welsh in school since I was about 4 and me nor my fellow classmates can still speak a word. It is a waste of money. I do not consider myself an 'EXTREMIST' for feeling deprived of a fair education because I have to take full course Welsh at GCSE whereas English pupils get another option. Welsh is not useful in anyway outside of Gwynedd although another MFL or humanity would be very useful for my life prospects. I find it very ignorant of some of you to comment that if I don't like Welsh I should emigrate. That is rude. We have a failing NHS in Wales yet so much is spent on the Welsh language. I have done some research to find the appalling truth that 1/3 of the education budget goes to Welsh medium schools although only about 10% of pupils attend these schools. I hate the Welsh language being forced down my throat and I find it outrageous that in an English medium school I am refused the right to go to the toilet if I don't ask in Welsh. I could go on for ages about how disgusting the education system and everything else to do with the Welsh language is in Wales but I ought to keep my sanity. Don't even get me started on Welsh Baccalaureate. And please don't tell me wrong because I am just as Welsh as Welsh speakers so don't tell me otherwise. Everyone has the right to their own opinion.

It really is time to stop spending more money on English medium education in Scotland and start properly funding both Gaelic medium education and its development. For years the Gaelic cultural and heritage products have been putting £10Billion plus into the Scottish and British economy yet the Gaelic language and its culture sees none of it. English language education could easily be funded from money from the mother country that being England or if you wishto call it Britain.

Tri gair...CYMRU AM BYTH. Then end, nos da.

Jacques at it again? I do wish he'd leave us alone and go back to Serbia or wherever.

The whole Welsh language and culture issue raises my hackles. I publish the below as someone who broadcast every weekday for a decade on BBC Radio Wales until I departed for Australia 1989, For those old enough I was Mike Flynn on BBC Radio Wales. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Radio_Wales On a personal level I grew up in Ruabon speaking English and went to school in Wrexham. I attended what was called the Catholic school,St Joseph's and was only ever aware of one other special school in the town in the early 1960's. Ysgol Morgan Clywd was what we called the 'Welsh School. In those days there was no great political movement regarding the language. Indeed most people in North East Wales were and I think still are more aligned to Chester and Merseyside. Some years later I left Radio City in Liverpool and in 1978 entered a totally new Welsh dimension when I joined BBC Radio Wales. I was quickly informed that despite rudimentary broadcasting facilities existing at Grosvenor Rd in Wrexham, which I used briefly ,I had to move to Cardiff. The politics would not permit me to broadcast from the town. So I gave in. I spent a decade in a new environment at their HQ in Cardiff. In short it was like being transported to a foreign country where my new Wales was not the Wales I had grown up in. However the remunaration was now far in excess of what commercial radio would have given me had I stayed in Wrexham. I had a nice office in the Llandaff building, built a big house and learnt to fly. Then I bought the ultimate toy,a light aircraft with my name and BBC Radio Wales on the tail. Paid for by the BBC press office in Cardiff. We did all sort of stunts over the 10 years of my daily programme to raise the profile of BBC Radio Wales. However I was always aware that my presence on the station was some sort of PR sop to tne North East Wales community. By the mid 80's the mines, steelworks and heavy industry had collapsed in that part of Wales. The BBC in Cardiff had to justify how they spent the money from London. In my opinion the bulk of the money has has always been spent on the Welsh language industry. Meanwhile Radio Wales now approaches a situation where 95% of the population of Wales never listen. In contrast Radio Ulster has 20% reach and all the English local radio stations average 10%, In the case of the latter on a very small budget compared to Radio Scotland,Wales and Ulster. It appears that as Llandaff now sinks like the Titanic they still cannot see that the licence fee is there to pay for a public service that reflects Wales and not the Tafia in Cardiff.

Taxi for Brian ap Francis. PLEASE!

Gwlad, Gwlad, pleidiol wyf i'm gwlad, Tra môr yn fur i'r bur Hoff bau " O BYDDED I'R HEN IAITH BARHAU"

What money is spent on promoting English? First, look at the work of the British Council, then any money used to promote English language culture.

The position of the Universal Esperanto Association (UEA) on Linguistic Rights: http://www.linguistic-rights.org/en/about.html - International Mother Language Day: http://www.linguistic-rights.org/21-02-2017/ - Message of Rita IZSÁK, UN Independent Expert (later: Special Rapporteur) on minority issues: http://www.linguistic-rights.org/esperanto-125/Rita-Izsak-UN-independent-expert-on-minority-issues.html

We must get more organised.

why are you being selective in the comments you publish? it's not like my comment wasn't off topic or used offensive language. it raised a fair point. this is exactly the problem right here, you're not allowing a presentation the full picture and censor those that don't share their opinions it seems. nation cymru indeed! more like nation cymru for the select few in the middle classes that have their own agenda regardless of what the majority of people in wales actually want

Dyma'r sylw anfonais i cwmni Dennis UK The BBC, and the usually more balanced part of the English Press, such as The Guardian and Times, and now the Dennis UK organisation, seem to have a blind spot about the significance of the Welsh Language, in relation to the heritage of the British Isles as a whole. It is important to note that the fore-runner of Welsh, namely Brythonic, was spoken from Glasgow to Kent before the regime change that occurred with the coming of germanic speaking groups in the 5th Century. Central England was at the heart of the Brythonic speaking world, until the native population was largly enslaved by first the Romans and then the Anglo-Saxon ruling class. Brythonic groups were referred to as Britons or British, but from about the 12th century onwards the Germanic groups, or English, through appropriation, started to include themselves in term British. This identity theft was of course granted legal status in English law in 1707, with the Act of Union. Increasingly the over the years, the English ruling classes came to assert that English traditions and values were the only “true British values”, and started trying to impose these on those of Welsh or Scottish origin. The classic case of this was the “Brad y Llyfrau Gleision” when the Westminster Parliament sent monoglot English Anglican assesors to survey Education in Wales, a nation of largely monoglot Welsh speakers and Nonconformist. [In fairness to the English, some of this was promoted by Welshmen over-keen to ape the English in language, accents, and aspirations, a type we still see to this day]. During the 1920’s an anti-Welsh stance was in evidence at the BBC, with a negative reaction when asked if some broadcasts could be in Welsh. [E.R. Appleton BBC 1927] This only changed when the Free Irish radio authority started to broadcast some programmes in Welsh, for an audience in Wales. A reaction to this has been an increasing sentiment that the Welsh and the Scottish need to promote their Welsh and Scottish traditions, values and language. This has progressed to the point that in the 21st Century, most Scots consider themselves Scots and NOT British, and many Welshmen to see themselves as Welsh and NOT British. [census 2011]. It is to be welcomed that people are restoring the ancient Central England forest of Arden, which was such a feature in South Warwickshire and Worcester from Brythonic to Shakspearian times. To most of us in Wales, it would be equally welcome if those in Central England became aware of, and embraced their Brythonic origins, and gave what encouagement they could to the enduring Brythonic culture in Wales, Welsh. The widespread ignorance about things Welsh in London based organisations, was once more in evidence during a poor quality discussion on Newsnight on the 9th of August 2017, when a minor author with a chip on his shoulder, Julian Ruck, was invited to air his grievances, which are out of touch with a modern-day bi-lingual Wales in a global multilingual world. Most international companies operate in many countries through many languages, with monoglot English speakers being rather handicapped in their appreciation of other cultures. We can only hope that the staff of the BBC pay more heed heed to J.R.R.Tolkiens and Benjamin Zephania advice on the Welsh language, and perhaps start learning it themselves! This also applies to the Whitehall immigration service, who, when Theresa May was Home Secretary, refused entry to the UK of 2 of Welsh descent from Patagonia who wished to improve their knowledge of Welsh, and attend the National Eisteddfod. This despite pleas from MP’s and the Welsh Government. It is highly unlikely that people of English descent from New Zealand or some other former colony, who wish to visit Stradford on Avon would have been refused entry. If Britain is to survive as an entity in any shape or form, with all the additional Brexit stresses, it will need a genuine commitment all round, to move to a federal structure. T Wms Rees

Mike Flynn, is he a character out of Phoenix NIghts / sounds very much like it

I am not an academic, just an ordinary 'man in the street', but through Welsh I have been able to assimilate some basic language skill in the Romance languages. I can use conversational French and am able to converse also in basic Italian. I perceive that it is mostly monoglots who make the most criticisms, not only of Welsh but many other languages. In answer to an English friend who said that so many foreign people spoke English (mostly to converse with English people!), I replied that like me, return to their own language when with others who also spoke their mother tongue. I am very critical of so many English who cannot even speak their own language correctly and wince at their literary vandalism. I was tempted like others to write my answer in Welsh but I thought that I would use English for those who can fully understand it. Oddi wrth Cymro pur a cariadus tuag at eu wlad.

Welsh is the original British language... ironic isnt it.......English imperialists telling us to become more "british" in identity......twp iawn

That was then, but now is now, and for better or worse, English is the language of this country so get over it.

Just to clarify some figures given earlier. 22% of pupils go to Welsh medium schools but that "Welsh medium" definition include Dual stream schools at primary level and different grades of "Bilingual schools" at secondary and middle school level. Having said that, Welsh medium schools make up nearly a third of all schools because the WM schools have smaller pupil numbers (nearly a half are dispersed rural schools in the Fro Cymraeg). Pupils numbers in WM schools are increasing quickly in the South east and other areas with low Welsh speaking populations but are decreasing or static in the North West due to rural depopulation. Welsh, the subject, is consistently the poorest performing core subject at the end of Primary school, Key stage 2, and has been for many years. Because of this there is a consistent fall in the number of pupils actually taking Welsh first language at the end of Key stage 3. The overall fall in Welsh first language assessment between KS1 and KS 3 is 18% on average or between 800 and 1200 pupils. Those who drop out are seemingly the pupils who did worst in their Welsh assessments and so the "quality" of the pupils who enter Welsh L1 Gcse is artificially high...this can also be seen in the Eligibility for free school meals figures amongst Welsh L1 GCSE pupils which is just 6% against 17.4% for all pupils. At Gcse, disproportionately, the A* and A grades are won by pupils who have Welsh speaking parents (speak Welsh at home). So, all in all, Welsh is taught badly even in WM schools and in EM schools it is pointless. Against this GCSE entries for MFLs have been at 22% for three years and fell to 21% this year making Wales the least multilingual country of the UK. The Welsh trends survey blames a crowded curriculum but, slyly, also blames Welsh subject teaching for turning pupils off languages.

I am an English first language speaker who moved to Wales to live with her Welsh first language husband. I also happen to be a linguist by profession and speak 4 languages, so get sick and tired hearing about how the English are monoglots whereas Welsh speakers are outward looking, cosmopolitan types who pick up other languages by osmosis. Sorry but it's rubbish. Apart from my own experiences, which are admittedly subjective and anecdotal, of the west Welsh being the most insular people I've ever lived among (and I've lived in various parts of the UK as well as abroad), the stats just don't back this up. As the post above points out, take up of MFLs in Wales is far below that of England. It should be leading the charge! For all of the trash talk usually encountered in Wales about the south east of England, it is by far the most inclusive, multilingual and cosmopolitan part of the UK. West Wales is beautiful with some lovely friendly people, but otherwise nothing like it. That's fine, but don't try to pretend it is some nirvana of outward looking multilingualism. I'm learning Welsh and love it, and thank goodness we are enlightened enough to educated Welsh first language children in their mother tongue, but English first language children should have the same choice, with incidental and conversational Welsh and English being taught respectively in each school. . And one last point - the constant references to 'our language was beaten out of us by the English' which all the local children seem to learn - that is rubbish. The Welsh Not was scandalous (as was pointed out in the infamous Blue Books) - but was inflicted by Welsh teachers with the support of parents who wanted their children to 'get on', not by the English! Yes people wrote hurtful things about the Welsh language - but they did about English dialects too - my Gran had her mouth washed out with soap whenever she spoke 'broad' at school in Yorkshire. My Grandad was beaten when he wrote with his left hand. Neither would be acceptable today, but historical context needs to be taken into account.

Truly wonderfully balanced and sensible thing to say.