Tuesday, 14th July 2026 Cardiff 26° · Clear sky
NationCymru A news service by the people of Wales, for the people of Wales.

Opinion

6 reasons why Welsh rugby is broken

By NationCymru

Support our Nation today

For the price of a cup of coffee a month you can help us create an independent, not-for-profit, national news service for the people of Wales, by the people of Wales.

22 comments

JWE

Absolutely outstanding article tackling the deep problems in Welsh rugby. Many of these were discussed at my recent end of season Welsh rugby district dinner evening. Ardderchog!

Reply
Jack

How do you fix it then? There are no solutions provided by the author in this article. Also it's really long and quite boring and I had to laugh at the idea of the M4 being some kind of untraversable barrier.

Reply
welshpaddler

Is the elephant in the room, rugby is no longer the sport of choice either to watch or play? On a small but annoying area which keeps me away is the " necessity " of playing "music" at every break in play. Scarlets are you listening!!?

Reply
Intolerant Of Bullshlt

Why not answer some of the questions about your article posted on; http://nugwlad.freeforums.net/thread/4441/more-powell Would be interesting... if of course you can answer them and debate.

Reply
Dai Sais

Good article, everything about rugby in Wales just feels stale ATM. I would love to see them go the FAW route and do some interesting marketing and make better use of the Welsh language. At the risk of sounding churlish, I would also love to see them ditch the three feathers and replace them with a more modern, positive Welsh symbol. New kit in the autumn, perfect chance, I won't hold my breathe.

Reply
Wilt

Just remember when the M4 Relief road is built there will be a region north of it

Reply
leigh richards

We'll probably never know whether the moffet plan for regional rugby was the right way for the domestic game in wales to go - tho the architect himself had some interesting things to say on it last year http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/david-moffetts-stunning-admission-regional-11709056. But i guess we are where we are and there's no way of going back to the old club structure which welsh rugby was based upon. But certainly it's been sad to see previously great historic clubs like swansea, neath, bridgend and pontypridd reduced to their current status scrambling around in the in front of a few hundred people in the welsh premier league. But the chief problem of regional rugby in wales has been that we er.....dont actually have 'regional' rugby. We had the forced marriage of neath and swansea, which to the great credit of all parties involved has led to the emergence in the shape of the ospreys of a meaningful and identifiable region. But then we've had 3 regions which have been little more than extensions of newport, llanelli and cardiff rfc respectively. I do chuckle every time the likes of gareth edwards or phil bennett or Emyr Lewis are interviewed at half time during televised blues or scarlets games in the pro 12. Wonderful players tho they were messrs edwards, bennett and lewis have nothing to do with the pro 12 teams the blues or the scarlets - these are entirely new entities created long after they hung up their boots. But of course we all really know that they arent 'new entities - and the people who support those pro 12 teams are people who supported cardif, newport and llanelli before the advent of regional rugby in wales. This in effect means large swathes of the rugby following population in wales dont have a professional team they feel they can support or go to watch. Throw in the ongoing scandal of the the WRU's neglect of professional rugby in north wales and its not hard to see why the domestic game in wales is drifting and crowds and interest are declining. Yes it can probably sustain itself with tv money but how sustainable is professional rugby in wales in the long term when so few people across wales are watching it? And how many young people will want to pursue a rugby career when the domestic game is so unattractive? And if young players stop coming thru the future for our national team will be bleak indeed. One response of the geniuses at the WRU has been to try and punish professional sports people from exercising their right to earn a living outside wales and threaten them with exclusion from the wales national team - the so named gatland's law. The irony of a 'law' named after someone who has spent his entire coaching career earming a living outside his own native country seems to have been lost on the idiots behind this move. Furthermore a country like wales with such a small player pool can ill afford to exclude international quality players. Okay a lot of gripes admittedly - sustainable solutions? Well how about the creation of a professional region in the north? This would probably mean losing a region in the south - so how about merging the dragons and the blues to create a glamorgan super region? And how about the regions playing competitive games throughout the geographical areas of wales they are meant to represent and to be developing? The ospreys playing games in neath and aberavon? the dragons playing at pontypool park and ebbw vale? and the blues playing at sardis road and bridgend?

Reply
brighty

1 - The complaint is that the northern half of the country is disenfranchised from professional rugby. This ignores the fact that before professional rugby there wasn't a significant North Wales based rugby team. This isn't a problem created by pro rugby, it is a reflection of the location of consumers, interest, etc. So by extension the assumption that we are missing out on a financial bonanza from the North is a completely baseless claim that ignores facts and history. 2 - This takes the writers own prejudices and extends them, without any critical thinking, to all rugby fans. Cardiff are supported by people from outside Cardiff, as the geographical spread of season ticket holders and the public transport use on match days will attest to. This entire point has no factual basis, it is simply the author assuming that everyone thinks like him. I am from the valleys. I support Cardiff. I am not alienated or disenfranchised. I choose my pro team. Conversely there is no evidence that some sort of unbadged team will suddenly double it's fanbase due to the previously "alienated" now dying to get involved. The Ospreys crowds are not what they were now they are not so successful, conversely the Scarlets season ticket sales are up after winning the Pro 12. Winning brings fans and interest, it really is that simple. Even the author's beloved Pontypridd have/had tiny crowds during their fallow periods. 3 - This point doesn't make any sense and again, ignores facts. First, Kiwi (and Aus, and SA) "stars" do make their way to the north when they decide that the increased money outweighs their chance of representative honours. I see no reason Welsh stars wouldn't do the same. The Union cannot set the value on a player, the market will do that. While we continue to have a lack of funds in Wales, Scotland, and Ireland, compared to the super powered clubs in Eng and Fra, players will move for the higher wages. No central ownership model will resolve this unless the plan is to push the union into massive debt instead of the clubs (see Ireland) or present some sort of plan that would significantly increase union revenues. Or perhaps the Kiwi model of being 1000s of miles away from the money to at least slow down the tide, can we move Wales away from England? 4 - There are not actually any facts in this section to even argue with. Baseless accusations of trust, or lack of (depending on which model he is talking about). It's just nonsense. 5 - This is clearly why England are also struggling on the world rugby ... oh .... This is just a nonsense reason now, run out of gas at point 3, clearly. 6 - "obvious non-alignment". Obvious is often used as a screen by those who actually have no evidence or facts, just a prejudice. This pseudo-management-speak has nothing to contribute. It means nothing and has no tangible impact. As for the summary - so the great hope of Welsh rugby is to find more tenants in financial dire straits so they can be turfed out of their valuable city centre properties, promises can be made and instantly broken (local suppliers) and second rate cast offs can be signed to "transform" the playing side. Brilliant. I can't wait.

Reply
leigh richards

i think the author of the opinion piece is calling for the wru to look to create a professional franchise in north wales - we are all aware there wasnt a very strong club base there pre professional rugby. But that is no reason why the wru shouldnt look to establish a regional team there - not unless you think its okay that for a large chunk of the welsh population their nearest professional team is over a 100 miles away at the other end of the country. And 'cardiff' (notice you don't call them the 'blues') clearly arent being supported by many people outside cardiff - else they wouldnt have posted losses of nearly 2 million at the end of last season http://www.walesonline.co.uk/business/business-news/welsh-rugby-can-only-sustain-12895129 And the reason the proposed takeover (http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/cardiff-blues-taken-over-wru-13008228) by the wru fell thru tells us a lot about the sham that is 'regional' rugby in wales. It didnt proceed because some people at the region wouldnt accept the word 'cardiff' being omitted from the side's name. They are not interested in the side being a region that would represent all fans and clubs in the geographical area the blues cover. If we are going to continue to have regional rugby in wales - and its clear we are - then let's do it properly. End the sham of some regions being little more than extensions of existing clubs. Ensure the regions take professional rugby out to all parts of their geographical area and end the anomaly whereby a large chunk of our population ie north wales is unrepresented in the modern professional era.

Reply
brighty

Leigh, your misconception is what "regional rugby" is. It is not a system of Wales wide representation in the same manner that the Welsh rugby team is. So your proposal for what it should mean doesn't align with what it is and will be. There will be no north Wales region until it can fund itself to the same level as the teams in the south - which goes back to my first point that the teams in the south are operating off existing and proven bases, the teams in the north never create such a base. There is no entitlement to a team near anyone or a team to represent anyone. This is professional sport, not a community enterprise. So yes, we are going to continue to have the current sides but no, they do not need to change to align with your opinion of what it means they should be. They are doing what they are designed to do - manage the pro game in Wales. Yes, I call them Cardiff. Why are you hung up on me needing to use only the second half of their name as you do? You didn't call them Cardiff Blues, which is their name. So I call them Cardiff, you call them Blues, we both know who we are talking about.

Reply

In reply to brighty

leigh richards

cheers for the reply brighty, geraint's opinion piece has prompted a good robust discussion among welsh rugby fans like ourselves. I hope geraint is following this thread and comments on some of the things we have all raised. Just a couple of points -You say "There will be no north Wales region until it can fund itself to the same level as the teams in the south" - but teams in the south aren't funding themselves! The dragons would have folded without a wru takeover, the scarlets would have folded in the past without the money they get from the wru and the blues financial problems are well known. You also say "There is no entitlement to a team near anyone or a team to represent anyone. This is professional sport, not a community enterprise" again if we took that approach there'd only be one professional team (the ospreys) left in wales. I think the chief difference in our respective viewpoints brighty is that i want to build the professional game in wales and you want to build cardiff. I'll leave readers to decide which approach is the best for the long term interests of welsh rugby.

Reply

In reply to leigh richards

brighty

Leigh, thank you also for the reply. I honestly don't want to only build Cardiff. However, given the inability for North Wales to sustain a major side in 100 years of pre-pro rugby I don't see how starting one up there now will generate the necessary funds. Cardiff does fund itself as shown by the fact it is still there. Yes, it has benefactors ploughing huge sums in but they are doing this. Investing for the future I hope. Without this they would no longer be there so I don't see how a North Wales side could do the same until it also has multi-million pound financial backing outside any that could/may come from the WRU for services rendered. With regards to Cardiff, or Scarlets, or any of the other teams, I think that one of the best assets we have is the history and brand recognition of Welsh rugby clubs, chiefly Cardiff, Llanelli, Swansea and Newport. When "Blues" play in France we are listed as Cardiff, ditto when we play in Ireland. Their media has no interest in some made up name, they want to trade off our world famous name, to get bums on seats and eyes on the TV. We are mad to throw that away, as we already are. For me there is definitely a tradeoff - ditch the famous names, suffer the reduced investment but possibly increase engagement with those who just cannot bring themselves to support those names. Or stick with the names, continue to attract the investment and try to handle the alienation some feel. In the pro game it then comes down to a choice as to which you think will generate the greatest revenue - as no game in Wales can be built without revenue. One of Cardiff's major sponsors has made no secret of his desire to be attached to the Cardiff name and would not do the same with some sort of "South Wales Pro XV" team or whatever they could be called. So it isn't about either Cardiff or "long term interests of Welsh rugby", plenty of us genuinely believe that the current system is the only/best option for Welsh rugby. Do I think we currently have major revenue problems? Yes. Do I think anything along the lines of what Geraint is proposing will address them? No. I don't (and I'm not saying you are proposing, but some do) think that "anything is better than what we have now" nor do I think that it is worth risking all we have now on the off chance this "affinity" increases and revenue and attendance increases enough. Maybe I just think that we have now is the best chance we have for there to be a future for Welsh rugby and it will never suit all people.

Reply
Shanksy

Your boss does not share your optimism (http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/we-heading-car-crash-regional-12400972). The word coming from Cardiff is that, unless the Athletic Club give them the ground for 100+ years, there is no future worth having for the Cardiff Blouses at all. Eff all valleys fans support the Blouses, and you know that. As funny as your diatribe was, Geraint is not one of us. Cardiff fans try and blame all your failings on Pontypridd. Geraint, whether you agree with him or not, and I would rather close down the current failed teams and start again rather than trying to update them like he wants, is an unashamed lifelong Pooler fan (https://thevietgwent.wordpress.com/). But he doesn't write complete rubbish like you do.

Reply
brighty

"Eff all Valleys fans....". There is no such thing as a Valleys fan. Your valley, Rhondda or Cynon, has nothing to do with mine. Skipping over that misconception of yours, I'll repeat my initial statement that people from the valleys do support Cardiff. It is a fact, one you clearly do not like, but one that clearly bothers you so much that you're prepared to pretend it isn't happening. I've read that article and it clearly doesn't agree with Geraint's points. I can't really see in my post where my "optimism" is. What I can see in yours is an attempt to take an article about Cardiff and pretend it aligns with what you think/want - no Cardiff named side, etc. That article doesn't do anything of the sort, it just correctly points out that there is a financial problem but then people like you mistakenly think it backs up your points of view. It doesn't. Your solutions would ruin the pro game in Wales.

Reply
brighty

As for the rest of your ranting nonsense. Blame Ponty for all of Cardiff's failings? Ponty are insignificant, they have nothing to do with Cardiff's problems. They couldn't influence anything so why would any Cardiff fan blame them for anything? Sounds like you're one of those Ponty "fans" who assumes there is some sort of an issue coming at you from the city. I repeat, we don't spend a moment thinking about you. It's clear you have issues with Cardiff - the sub primary school name calling, the dismissal of any contrary points of view as "writing rubbish". This is why Geraint's points are incorrect, because they assume there is a way to bring people like you to some sort of consensus in Wales but there isn't. You want exactly what you want. You want no mention of Cardiff because you can't stand it. That would be commercial nonsense but it doesn't matter to you because what you feel entitled to is more important than what is financially needed.

Reply

In reply to brighty

Shanksy

Same old obnoxious Cardiff arrogance from the same old suspects. The only way large numbers of valley folk can attend the Cardiff Blues matches is if nobody from Cardiff and the Vale is attending. Cardiff are a busted flush. Even the Pie man now realises this. Why he wants to get his hands on the Arms Park site and offload the massively lossmaking rugby team to the WRU. There is no kudos in leading a permanently rubbish rugby team, short of fans and sponsors.

Reply

In reply to Shanksy

brighty

Nonsensical response there "Shanksy" with the usual cliched prejudice and without answering any of my points. "The only way large numbers of valley folk can attend the Cardiff Blues matches is if nobody from Cardiff and the Vale is attending." - this makes no sense at all. What are you saying here - "valley folk" won't mix with people from Cardiff&Vale? Who knows what you mean, your reply makes no sense at all but your opening half sentence makes it clear - you have a significant problem with Cardiff. You assume arrogance. You can't stand Cardiff. This makes all of your views irrelevant as they are born of a misplaced hatred. This type of stuff is thankfully being swept away by the new generation who think it's nonsense to have any sense of distaste directed at a town close enough to walk to. You're a dying breed, a dinosaur. Cardiff will outlive you and your type and then the rest of us (I'm not from Cardiff) can get on with discussing things of real substance, like Leigh on here has, with the possibility of creating genuine solutions for Wales, not just our own village.

Reply
Gareth Wynn

NZ rugby will be sustained by the recent Lions tour for a while longer, but is, itself, out of necessity, moving away from the model espoused here. The loss of SA TV money to SuperRugby and the financial pulling power of French and English clubs will destabilise NZ rugby in the years ahead, so greater private investment is being sought to keep the All Blacks afloat (sound familiar?). Advocating the NZ model for Wales (or, indeed, anywhere but New Zealand) is like prescribing 'a course of leeches' for any and every malady. Whatever issues Welsh rugby has - and a number are down to irreversible, largely unavoidable historical factors - they will not be solved by vandalising what platform we have for the sake of the perennially professionally disenfranchised and bitter complainants. Notably, no solutions are offered here (ignoring the irrelevant references to New Zealand), but none can be as effective as further success on the pitch. And this can be brought about without great deconstruction using a holistic approach, Union partnered with independently-minded, competitive professional teams - lest we forget, this has brought about a relatively high degree of success in domestic and international Test competitions in recent years, and the potential is clearly there to perform even better when the divisive elements are ignored. In fact, it's already beginning to happen, with the best constructive relationship between WRU and pro teams for many a decade. We should build positively on what we have - success, belief, engagement and the resources for further steps will surely result.

Reply
Shanksy

Insane. Llanelli and Cardiff are financially at death's door and the WRU had to buy the Dragons and Rodney Parade to save Newport and keep professional rugby in Gwent. And stop Rodney Parade becoming a supermarket. You're in complete denial mate!

Reply
Gareth Wynn

Your reports of their (imminent) demise appear to have been exaggerated, Shanksy. ;o) A joined-up approach and revised RSA will continue to stabilise and build on the platform, helping to deliver a sustainable future for the pro game in Wales, despite a small band of embittered and/or self-disenfranchised 'commenters' who would rather see it all torn down in order to spite the current 'regions'. That would result in a fallow period which would make the Great Welsh Rugby Famine of 1978-2005 seem like a blip.

Reply
Mairwen Thomas

A very good summary of a number of the very difficult problems that 'the powers that be' cannot seem to resolve. I cannot help feeling that things will get worse before they get better. But Welsh rugby cannot go on like this at the regions/'super' clubs.

Reply
Justin R

Having moved to New Zealand in 1993, it has been very sad to see how Welsh rugby has failed to adapt to professional rugby. If it was decided that 4 teams were the affordable number of Welsh teams, I guess it was predictable that Newport, Swansea, Llanelli and especially Cardiff would try and take over the system and impose themselves on the rest of Welsh rugby. Screw everybody else was always their attitude, apart from perhaps Swansea. The arrogance runs deep. And entirely predictable that the result would be a dog's dinner of a system. I hope Welsh rugby finally gets its act together, for the natural talent that emerges rather than the undeserving suits and blazers and the fools that got Welsh rugby into this mess. Neath! Neath! Neath!

Reply

Leave a comment

Comments are reviewed before they appear.